Question about alternative treatment

kev · New User Joined: 05 Oct 2005 Posts: 5

Hi,

I posted under a different topic (Best Cancer Centers or Hospitals) that mikes replied to...thanks mike!! He had left a link to Dr. Arnold Smiths site: [url]http://cancernet.com/[/url]. I have been looking at this and it appears that it might be a good alternative to conventional treatment. They provide quite a few stories about survivors and some interesting concepts toward helping beat the odds. I was wondering, does anyone has had any experience with Dr. Smith (consultations or treatment)? Is this stuff real? Does it work?

We just found out yesterday that my dad has metastatic andenocarcinoma, stage iv lung cancer. I still do not know if this is considered NSCLC or SCLC...anyone have an idea here (i.e. can that be determined from the description above)?The oncologist told us it is not curable. We know that it has spread to the bones which he is scheduled to receive some radiation treatment for it. No spreading to other major organs. He has a brain CT scheduled to let us know if it spread there. We also know that there is a small amount of fluid in the lung where the tumor is and that there is fluid around the heart. The oncologist indicated that they want to see of the chemo will help the fluid level around the heart before trying surgical intervention.

Any thoughts or help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Kev

mikes · Senior User Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 143

kev,

Andenocarcinoma is one of the forms of NSCLC.

You already know from your oncologist that this is incurable, so I will speak of it in those terms. If a person doesn't already know this, I am reluctant to be the one who gives the news.

Since the disease is incurable, the conventional treaments given for it are referred to a palliative treatments which are not intended to cure, but rather provide symtomatic relief.

When you consider that chemotherapy can cause nausia, hearing and sight problems, organ failure, appetite problems, etc, it is hard to see how it could be considered palliative in any real sense. In addition it wrecks the immune system and blood chemistry. Gemzar is one of the most common chemos for NSCLC. Have a look at www.gemzar.com and go to the prescribing information. It says you can have renal failure after just one treatment.

If a person has a type of cancer that can actually be cured with chemo, then it might make sense to use it in spite of the risks. But with no chance of cure, why go through it?

It is not uncommon to need packed red cell blood transfusing every 3 or 4 weeks, as the chemo very commonly ruins the red blood count and can also harm the white cells and platelets as well.

If you get too many blood transfusions, the body may begin to reject the infused cells and the spleen will sequester these cells and become greatly enlarged. This in combination with renal and heart damage from the chemo took my Wife's life. This scenario is not at all uncommon.

Even large reputable clinics like MD Anderson do some work similar to Dr. Smith's while PSK is a standard treatment in Japan for 20 years. Melatonin treatment is fairly common in Europe (esp Italy) and is begining to be used in a few clinics in the US. PSK and Melationin both enhance the activity of the P53 gene which the gene that controls cell growth. Both are relatively inexpensive but most insurance won't cover them especially if you buy them on your own.

Celebrex is being tested for P53 activity and has had some favorable trials although it has a down side concerning potential cardiac problems.

Most who have survived this disease for much more than one year have done so using some of the alternative treatments such as I have described. There are others out there but melatonin and PSK are the most common and have little or no adverse effects. With melatonin you should avoid Procardia and any steroid such as prednesone or dexamethasone.

Many claim that either red wine or grape seed extract are helpful. Some research indicates that these also enhance the P53 gene.

Radiation treatments can also cause blood count problems especially if the target are includes the spine, ribs, sternum, or pelvis because these are the most productive areas of marrow producing blood cells. We we not warned of this. My wife also had a case of cellulitis due to radiation exposure to the skin on her leg. This is curable, but can be dangerous.

I hope this has helped.

Mike

kev · New User Joined: 05 Oct 2005 Posts: 5

Mike,

I am so sorry to hear about your wife! Thank you for posting here and helping other people find information that may help them. It's very kind of you!

I called Dr. Smith's office and spoke to his assistant [name is Dan i think] (or colleague?) and told him the details of my dad's case. He said that they see a lot of that type and in fact Mississippi has one the highest rates of lung cancer (as compared to other types of cancer). They also said that they have good success rates with it (what that really means...I don't know) The methods they describe make sense, they indicate that you need to boost the body's natural abiltiy to rid itself of cancer cells first, then they use some medication to help the effectivity of the radiation and chemo and by using this additional medication the amount of radiation and chemo can be reduced and yet be just as or more effective. So to me that seems great, your're not bombarding the body with large amounts of radiation and chemo thereby reducing side-affects. They do give hope...though MY hope is that the ideas are sound...and true to the presentation of the patients and data they provide on the website. That is why I was hoping to find someone, not directly related to their website, that could confirm that their methods helped them. I want to trust them completely but with what they are saying it seems that it might be "too good to be true"...does that make sense? All in all I think it is the best shot we have at helping my dad. They have numerous survivors for lung cancer...I would like to get some numbers around that though...Do you think this might be false hope? Given your last post it seems that you might be thinking that PSK or Malatonin might be better than what this place is offering. I could be reading into that though...

Anyhow, my dad called down to them and he is going to talk with Dr. Smith tomorrow. They are going to schedule a consultation next week. He is scared as hell and does not want to give up! He wants to fight this thing head on, whatever it takes.

By the way they had my dad scheduled for 5 days of radiation treatment of the lower back area. Followed by 6 cycles of Carboplatin and taxol every three weeks. Depending upon how his conversation Dr. Smith goes he will cancel this treatment and head down to Miss for a while.

This post might be all over the place and I apologize for that...I am bring things up as I remember them or have something say...

I was taking notes during the consultation and listening to what the oncologist was saying...and I have to say that his tone, demeaner, and opinions did not sit well with me. Something just didn't seem right...He indicated that one or two years would probably be the limit for my dad (I had asked him on the side what he thought). I am not will to let my dad go that easily!! NO WAY!! I want to help him have a fighting chance!

I need to look at the other things you mention, I wonder if they could be used in conjuction with Dr. Smith's treatment...

Thanks again Mike!!

Kev

mikes · Senior User Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 143

Kev,

That place DOES use melatonin as part of their immune therapy. The site does not mention PSK.

The reason I mention the melatonin and PSK in the manner that I did was that these are an option in themselves. Part of the problem that my Wife and I experienced was the continuous trips to the hospital and clinic that were always called for. She lived about 300 days after diagnosis. Of these 300 days, almost 100 were spent going to the clinics for radiation (daily) or chemo (weekly). Each of these days was spent in an unpleasant environment away from the comfort and security of home or my work place. (I kept her with me at all times).

If I had known about Dr. Smith's clinic or melatonin/PSK we would have used one of these options.

At Dr. Smith's clinic and in many clinical trials, melatonin is used in conjunction with conventional treatment. In other trials, it is used without conventional treatment. Since melatonin enhances the immune system, it is said to reduce many of the side effects of chemo.

The underlying theme of my approach is that these alternatives offer some degree of hope where there otherwise is none.

There is a new experimental drug (the name escapes me) being used in a trial at MD Anderson where a lady has lived over 5 years with stage IV NSCLC. It involves the injection of P53 genes using a virus as a vehicle. It is not on the market yet. Every case I have researched involving extended lifespan seems to involve some aspect of the P53 gene. There is a doctor in Kentucky doing pioneering research in immune therapy who has achieved encouraging results.

There are a ton of herbal products on the market which may be fine or even nutritional, but using them hasn't achieved clinical results.

You can go to PubMed which is the main repository for medical information in this country and see clinical results for melatonin and PSK. They seem to do no harm and offer a better quality of life and extended lifespan in many cases. Conventional treatment, by it own admission, will not cure the disease, which offers no hope... just a huge bill and much inconvenience, insecurity, discomfort, and a ruined immune system. Each trip to the hospital for a transfusion takes a whole day (usually 2 units). In the winter it was dark when we arrived and dark when she was done. It ruins the whole day and offers the depression of the hospital environment. This lowers the spirit. A person's spirit under these circumstances is very important to their well being.

I only know of Dr. Smith's clinic from searching the web. I have never contacted them. You are the only person I know who has. The important thing to me is that they offer hope. There were some comments in one of the sections of the site that led me to believe that they were aware of the depressive atmosphere in a hospital and that they were more "user-friendly" (my words, not theirs).

What Dr. Smith's clinic says may be "too good to be true", I don't know. After my Wife died I could not sleep very well. I was searching the web for sleep remedies. I found melatonin (among others). In further checking of melatonin in Google searches, I found out that melatonin was used as a treatment for cancer. In more searches, I stumbled across Dr. Smith's site. It seemed to confirm much of what I had just learned. To put it another way, I asked myself why no one used melatonin in clinics if it was so good. The answer is that some clinics do (either as mainstream treatment or in trials). Dr. Smith seems to have good credentials, but I haven't checked them out. If I had it to do over, I would take my Wife to a clinic like Dr. Smiths's or stay home and use melatonin and PSK with a good diet. Either of these is much better than what we went through.

Try to keep your Dad's spirits as high as possible, and try to offer him nutritious food that appeals to his taste. After chemo, some of his tastes will change.

I pray that he will do well.

Mike

kev · New User Joined: 05 Oct 2005 Posts: 5

Mike,

Fortunately, My dad really wants to beat this thing! He is focused, determined and has a positive attitude...but like you mentioned with the mentality of the hospital itself, the visit took a lot out of him, and that was just a visit!! They basically offered the standard treatment and no real hope. So I definately agree with you there! As I was wathcing the videos and reading their website I started to wonder why I have never heard of Dr. Smith or the Immunothrapy treatment, especially when it seems have some success. When watching local news you often hear about cancer break-throughs or at least new things dealing with cancer and I just don't remember seeing anything about this. I wonder if any of the hospitals that are big into cancer treatment or research have heard of Dr. Smith's clinic and what they think of it. It's a bit overwhelming and hard to find a place to start...especially with finding outside opinions of another facility.

The one thing that I would like to find out from Dr. Smith is actual numbers of survivors to total patients seen for the type of cancer my dad has. I am trying to search the web for more information of Dr. Smith's clinic and the P53 gene.

I did look at a few things regarding PSK and Melotonin and there are inidcations that they may help with battling cancer...mainly in addition to conventional treatment. I was going to ask Dr. Smith about them and it sounds like you know that they do in fact use Malotinin so that seems like a good starting point. I am looking forward to finding out more information about Dr. Smith and the supplements that might be able to help my dad.

Thanks again,

Kev

Paul · Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 9:31 pm Post subject: alternative cancer treatment

Kev,

I think you shouldn't stop your search at just one clinic. I am firmly convinced that good results can be obtained by combining traditional and alternative cancer therapies. If it is impossible to cure the inless, skilled doctors can at least get it under control and provide the patient with quality life. I recommend that you browse http://www.[NO MARKETING HERE].org/ - their clinic is lead by a renowned specialist, Dr T.R. Shantha, and they offer some really advanced treatment methods using Insuline Potentiation Therapy, modern medications like Ukrain, and more. Patients' testimonials, some even on video, seem very promissing. Hope this information might help you and your father.

Paul

kev · New User Joined: 05 Oct 2005 Posts: 5

Thank you Paul!! I am spending a lot of time searching...and I really appreciate your post. I did happen to come across that site but I only was able to add it to my favorites...I will go back and look at it tonight. Processing all this information can be a little overwhelming sometimes. I wonder what their sucess rates are with Stage IV Adenocarcinoma Lung Cancer is. One thing I have found is that it is hard to get anyone to state what their success rates are, I would have thought that if they had a rate that is higher than the average of conventional treatment they would be happy to share it...just doesn't seem to be the case. Sad

I am still very worried...there is a ton of information to sort through and I want to be able to help my dad make the right choice...he has done so much for me and I want to help him in his time of need. But I also realize that time is not on our side...I really hope we make the right choice...whatever it is that we choose. I do not feel that conventional treatment alone is going to be sufficient (from what I have read so far and from what people are saying)...he is going to need the help of something else...whatever that may be.

I hope and pray that some day nobody will have to suffer and/or succumb to cancer.

Kev

lesliehand · New User Joined: 23 Apr 2006 Posts: 1

I was just reading your email exchange and was wondering the status of your Dad's treatment. Did you ever go to the CancerNet place?

Leslie

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