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Thread: Kegals

  1. #1

    Kegals

    How soon after your catheter was out did you start your kegals again? Any recommendations on how often and when to start? O and husband bladders spasms are not at a 10 after 2nd cath removal, he did say a quick 2-3 second spasm would happen after having BM or finish voiding.. He advised sharp spasm and then would immediately go away. Any of you have that? If so, did you notice it went away after awhile. (ie. few days/weeks)
    DOB 5/76
    Age 42
    PSA 2017 n/a, 1/2018 2.66 1/2019 3.39 Reset 2/019 3.04
    MRI 3/2019 3 Lesions 2 Pirads 3 and 1 Pirad 4
    Biopsy 4/11/2019
    PCA positive- all grade group 1 and Gleason score 6(3+3)
    RMB: involving 10% of 1 core
    RMM: involving10% of the tissue (fragmented specimen).
    RMA: High-grade prostatic intraepithelial neoplasia.
    RLB: involving 25% of 1 core.
    RLM: involving 70% of the tissue
    RLA: involving 50% of 1 core.
    LMB: involving 80% of 1 core.
    Lesion #2, in 3 of 3 cores, involving 80%
    of total tissue
    RALP 6/5/19 USMD Arlington Dr Robert Parham
    Cath 6 days, bladder spasms, cath back in for 5 days
    Grade group 1, Gleason 6(3+3)
    SV, bladder neck invasion, adipose tissue, ECE, Margins, 0 of 8 lym- all negative, prostate confined~ PT2N0
    10% of prostate involved by tumor

    Quest Diagnostics: uPSA
    9/7/19 (3m) <0.02

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Honeybun078 View Post
    How soon after your catheter was out did you start your kegals again? Any recommendations on how often and when to start? O and husband bladders spasms are not at a 10 after 2nd cath removal, he did say a quick 2-3 second spasm would happen after having BM or finish voiding.. He advised sharp spasm and then would immediately go away. Any of you have that? If so, did you notice it went away after awhile. (ie. few days/weeks)
    Start Kegals now. I found them easiest in the beginning while sitting or lying down, but transitioning to standing gives the largest benefit. 10 reps 2-3 times a day.
    YOB 1957

    DX 12/18, GS 8, 4+4 6/12 cores, LL Apex 100%, LM Apex 60%, LL Mid 50%, LMM 40%, LL Base 5%, LM <5%, Right side negative.

    3/6/19. Pathology - Grade Group 4 with Intraductal Carcinoma
    T3aNO, GS8, 21 mm unifocal tumor 10%. -7 Nodes, - SV, - Margins, - PNI,
    - bladder neck neg., +LVI, + EPE non focal apex/mid lateral 1mm max extension, Cribriform pattern present. Decipher .86 High Risk.

    PSA 3/27/19 03 (29 days)
    4/25/19 <.03. (58 days)
    5/25/19 <.02. (88 days)
    9/10/2019. <.02. (198 days)

    3 Part Modality Treatment

    2/25/19 Robotic Laparoendoscopic Single Site Surgery outpatient Cleveland Clinic,

    ADT - started 6/19, end date 6/21.

    ART - Completed 9/26/19. (78 Gy, yes, I glow in the dark)

  3. #3
    Moderator Top User HighlanderCFH's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    7,232
    Check the forum sticky threads for a copy of Mayo Clinic's instructions for Kegel exercises which, they also say, should be done for the rest of our lives.
    July 2011 local PSA lab reading 6.41 (from 4.1 in 2009). Mayo Clinic PSA 9/ 2011 = 5.7.
    Local uro DRE revealed significant BPH, no lumps.
    PCa Dx Aug. 2011 age of 61.
    Biopsy DXd adenocarcinoma in 3/20 cores (one 5%, two 20%). T2C.
    Gleason 3+3=6. CT abdomen, bone scan negative.
    DaVinci prostatectomy 11/1/11 at Mayo Clinic (Rochester, MN), nerve sparing, age 62.
    Surgeon was Dr. Matthew Tollefson, who I highly recommend.
    Final pathology shows tumor confined to prostate.
    5 lymph nodes, seminal vesicules, extraprostatic soft tissue all negative.
    1.0 x 0.6 x 0.6 cm mass involving right posterior inferior, right posterior apex & left
    mid posterior prostate. Right posterior apex margin involved by tumor over 0.2 cm length,
    doctor says this is insignificant.
    Prostate 98 grams, tumor 2 grams.
    Catheter out in 7 days. No incontinence, minor dripping for a few weeks.
    Eight annual post-op exams 2012 through 2019: PSA <0.1
    Semi-firm erections without "training wheels," usable erections with 100mg Sildenafil.
    NOTE: ED caused by BPH, not the surgery.

  4. #4
    Top User garyi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HighlanderCFH View Post
    Check the forum sticky threads for a copy of Mayo Clinic's instructions for Kegel exercises which, they also say, should be done for the rest of our lives.
    Agreed....and there is a lot of excellent kegal (kegel) information if you do a simple search.
    72...LUTS for the past 7 years
    TURP 2/16,
    G3+4 discovered
    3T MRI 5/16
    MRI fusion guided biopsy 6/16
    14 cores; four G 3+3, one G3+4,
    CIPRO antibiotic = C. Diff infection 7/16
    Cured with Vanco for 14 days
    Second 3T MRI 1/17
    Worsened bulging of posterior capsule
    Oncotype DX GPS 3/17, LFP risk 63%, Likelihood of Low
    Grade Disease 81%, Likelihood of Organ Confined 80%
    RALP 7/13/17 Dr. Gonzaglo @ Univ of Miami
    G3+4 Confirmed, Organ confined
    pT2 pNO pMn/a Grade Group 2
    PSA 0.32 to .54 over 3 months
    DCFPyl PET & ercMRI Scans - 11/17
    A one inch tumor still in prostate bed = failed surgery
    All met scans clear
    SRT, 2ADT, IMGT 70.2 Gys @1.8 per, completed 5/18
    Radiation Procitis, and Ulcerative Colitis flaired after 20 years
    PSA <.006 9/18, .054 11/18, .070 12/18, .067 2/19, .078 5/19, .074 7/19, .081 9/19
    We'll see....what is not known dwarfs what is thought to be fact

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by garyi View Post
    Agreed....and there is a lot of excellent kegal (kegel) information if you do a simple search.
    The correct spelling will help....you don't want a recipe for a noodle casserol/pudding (kugel)....or maybe you do.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by DjinTonic View Post
    The correct spelling will help....you don't want a recipe for a noodle casserol/pudding (kugel)....or maybe you do.
    Now you got me searching....
    YOB 1957

    DX 12/18, GS 8, 4+4 6/12 cores, LL Apex 100%, LM Apex 60%, LL Mid 50%, LMM 40%, LL Base 5%, LM <5%, Right side negative.

    3/6/19. Pathology - Grade Group 4 with Intraductal Carcinoma
    T3aNO, GS8, 21 mm unifocal tumor 10%. -7 Nodes, - SV, - Margins, - PNI,
    - bladder neck neg., +LVI, + EPE non focal apex/mid lateral 1mm max extension, Cribriform pattern present. Decipher .86 High Risk.

    PSA 3/27/19 03 (29 days)
    4/25/19 <.03. (58 days)
    5/25/19 <.02. (88 days)
    9/10/2019. <.02. (198 days)

    3 Part Modality Treatment

    2/25/19 Robotic Laparoendoscopic Single Site Surgery outpatient Cleveland Clinic,

    ADT - started 6/19, end date 6/21.

    ART - Completed 9/26/19. (78 Gy, yes, I glow in the dark)

  7. #7
    Top User garyi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Posts
    1,373
    Quote Originally Posted by DjinTonic View Post
    The correct spelling will help....you don't want a recipe for a noodle casserol/pudding (kugel)....or maybe you do.
    ....No kugel recipes, please.

  8. #8
    Senior User
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Posts
    185
    My response is too late for Honeybun078 but I'm adding it here in case someone else comes across this thread. The best time to start kegels is when you THINK you might be having prostate cancer treatment. Three months to a year before surgery. I started more than a year before I had surgery and it really paid off after surgery.
    DOB 1961
    2010-05 2.42
    2015-07 7.0
    2015-08 5.4
    2016-02 6.2
    2016-09 7.86
    2017-02 7.2
    2017-05 5.65
    2017-06 biopsy 7 of 13 cores G6
    2017-10 7.11
    2018-04 7.47
    2018-11 11.80

    2019-01 Da Vinci RALP
    Pathology report:
    Final stage pT2C
    Histologic type: Acinar adenocarcinoma with focal mucinous features
    Grade: 3+4=7 35% pattern 4
    23% of prostate involved
    EPE-
    BNI-
    SVI-
    PNI+
    LVI+
    Margins focally positive [1-3 mm] 4 locations
    Cribriform pattern noted

    Roche ECLIA uPSA
    2019-03 0.133
    2019-04 0.116
    2019-05 0.143
    2019-06 0.140
    2019-07 0.183
    2019-08 0.197
    2019-08 Start Lupron/Casodex
    2019-10 0.007

    2019-09 Decipher score .49

  9. #9
    My surgeon recommended starting kegals before surgery. Then starat again after catheter removal.

    5 months post surgery I was fully continent and am to this day (2 years post surgery) even after going through salvage radiation (ending mid March).
    There is no right or wrong decision for treatment. Make the decision you are comfortable with and can live with and not second guess if all does not go optimally.

    6/2016 PSA 5.1, negative DRE
    6/2016 Urologist PSA 6.0, %free = <10% chance cancer, negative DRE
    12/2016 PSA 7.7, %free = 50% chance cancer, negative DRE
    2/2017 biopsy Bostwick 5/12 3+3, perineural invasion. Hopkins 5/12, 4 3+3, 1 3+4 (5% 4), perineural invasion
    5/17/2017 Open RP by Dr Alan Partin - Hopkins (5500+ prostate cancer surgeries, open & robotic)
    5/2017 Pathology 3+4, T2x, +margin (6mm, 3+3), organ contained except unevaluable at +margin, moderate tumor extent
    seminal vesicles, lymph nodes all neg
    Age: 62 @ surgery
    8/2017 PSA < .1
    11/2017 PSA <.1
    5/2018 uPSA .06, standard .1
    8/2018 uPSA .07, standard .1
    11/2018 uPSA .10, standard .1
    12/29/2018 6 month Lupron shot
    1/22/2019 start SRT, 39 treatments, 5 days per week
    3/15/19 ended SRT with no significant side effects

 

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